Greenland Paddle

General Kayak Fishing Discussions
slomartin
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Thu Mar 02, 2017 9:53 am

Tried HLD's greenland paddle the other day for about 3 minutes. It was right on the back of paddling with a grunty whitewater paddle with an almighty and instant catch, so the contrast was beyond comfortable. Would take some getting used to, but I can definitely see the attraction. Mightily tempted to add one to the shopping list soon.

For the record, my glass touring euro comes in at 900g (the carbon version of it being approx 820g) and my carbon wing comes in at approx 750g. both could probably lose a few more g if they weren't split shafts.

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Blazer60
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Fri Mar 03, 2017 12:47 pm

Well all the positive comments around Greenland paddles worked. I lashed out and bought one of Max's art pieces and, it's so light! Pics as per PeterNZ's original post. He is such a great guy to deal with, the paddle came with oil, and some guidance around paddle use. If you are on the cusp of changing weapons, give Max a nudge. He's an artist.
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Hairy Little Dwarf
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Fri Mar 03, 2017 1:50 pm

I'll be paddling with him again tomorrow - I'll let him know the positive feedback :y:

Be prepared to spend a bit of time getting to grips with it, but once you do, I reckon you'll never go back 8)
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.................... "Flying Mango"....................
Phoenix Hornet - Specialty Assault Craft

Dad! Dad! Look at his fish! It's way bigger than anything you've EVER caught! - Nosey 7-8yo boy on opening my icebox to father strapping down his $XXX Stabicraft 759(?) - Gold. Pure Gold.

kingiFiddler
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Tue Apr 04, 2017 8:30 pm

Am thinking I should have a crack at making one of these over Winter. Being born with a dominant 'belligerent bastid' gene, I'm going to make it from native timbers because I was warned it wasn't the best idea.

I've been reading around about styles and sizing but am still a bit confused about how the ideal (perfect-world where both yak and paddle were once made to suit the person) loom width changes to accommodate the actual width of the wider yaks we fish from.

If it weren't already taken, "Hairy Little Dwarf" could have been my ideal username. Further, I'm also using a Phoenix Hornet yak. So, perhaps a few similarities might mean HLD has already been down this sizing road? Or maybe someone else could help please?

Otherwise I'll just make one as a test run, then another two at different sizes and see which works better and try to figure out why. At worst, the neighbour will get some free firewood.

Ta.

Mac50L
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Tue Apr 04, 2017 9:43 pm

kingiFiddler wrote:Am thinking I should have a crack at making one of these over Winter. Being born with a dominant 'belligerent bastid' gene, I'm going to make it from native timbers because I was warned it wasn't the best idea.
Yes there are native timbers that would work. But do you know what they are and how to make them work?
I've been reading around about styles and sizing but am still a bit confused about how the ideal (perfect-world where both yak and paddle were once made to suit the person) loom width changes to accommodate the actual width of the wider yaks we fish from.
How much further apart do you hold the loom (paddle shaft) when paddling a SOT versus a narrower kayak? The Greenland loom is usually the width measured from the outer edge of one fist to the outer edge of the other fist with them against your hips and knuckles facing forward. You hold the paddle with your first finger and thumb on the loom, other fingers wrapped over the blade. So paddling hand spacing is roughly hips plus 4 hand widths.
I'll just make one as a test run, then another two at different sizes and see which works better and try to figure out why. At worst, the neighbour will get some free firewood.
You have looked at -
http://www.kask.org.nz/category/do-it-yourself/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
or
https://sites.google.com/site/kayakamf/ ... nd-paddles" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The first link shows a number of websites and construction methods (scroll down to near the bottom of the page). The second link, how to make one and save on wastage. This is the method I always use.

kingiFiddler
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Wed Apr 05, 2017 10:01 am

Mac50L wrote:
kingiFiddler wrote:Am thinking I should have a crack at making one of these over Winter. Being born with a dominant 'belligerent bastid' gene, I'm going to make it from native timbers because I was warned it wasn't the best idea.
Yes there are native timbers that would work. But do you know what they are and how to make them work?
Nope and nope.

Thanks for the links.

Mac50L
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Wed Apr 05, 2017 2:57 pm

Mac50L wrote: Yes there are native timbers that would work. But do you know what they are and how to make them work?
kingiFiddler wrote:Nope and nope.
Paulownia grows in New Zealand but isn't a native. Kahikatea might be the lightest there is.
https://www.halswelltimber.co.nz/kahikatea.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dacrycarpus_dacrydioides" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

One paddle I made has a thin strip of kwila down the middle of it, 3 mm max, possible go down to 2 mm. Definitely fit tips, again I used kwila so you need to find an NZ timber, (black beech?) with similar strength/impact density.

This site has some information -

http://www.nzwood.co.nz/forestry-2/lc-t ... s-species/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Some density comparisons -

http://www.nzwood.co.nz/wp-content/uplo ... ative1.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

bas
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Wed Apr 05, 2017 4:51 pm

Wouldn't paulownia be too soft for a paddle? I used it to make a strip plank canoe but I covered both sides in fibre glass for a hard shell. I'm not sure that bare paulownia would handle any knocks too well.

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Hairy Little Dwarf
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Wed Apr 05, 2017 8:47 pm

Hi KingiFiddler,
Just some random Dwarvish thoughts.
I run a wide loom partly due to my shoulders being further apart than the average dwarf (loom about 70cm from memory) and I tend to be a very vertical paddler when travelling. The GP's push the Hornet along at a respectable and sustainable 4kts.
I've made several blades, and have only ever used Sandys recipe from the KASK site. I like the way it's easy to slip a strip into the lamination to jazz it up a bit.
None of my blades have had tips, but then I don't bury them into rocks or beaches. My first blade, aside from a bit of fluff on the end, was still sharp after couple of years.

Also, apart from centrelines, I carve them by eye now - letting the wood take me where it wants to go, only using a saw and antique spokeshave. Powertools make hundreds of mistakes a second if you're not careful :lol:

Can't help you with native timber, but would suggest trying a length of cedar or redwood for the first one. It's just soooo relaxing peeling long curls off the blade in between sips of favourite beverage. Keep an eye on the guidelines though, or you will start a collection of norsaq! :lol:

Good luck, and let's see the pics when you have a go :y:
Image
.................... "Flying Mango"....................
Phoenix Hornet - Specialty Assault Craft

Dad! Dad! Look at his fish! It's way bigger than anything you've EVER caught! - Nosey 7-8yo boy on opening my icebox to father strapping down his $XXX Stabicraft 759(?) - Gold. Pure Gold.

kingiFiddler
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Thu Apr 06, 2017 8:17 am

Thanks HLD. By extending the loom, did you extend the overall length by a similar margin, so that the blade length stayed somewhere around 800mm?

Everyone can tell me they told me so, for not using cedar, choosing instead somewhat unconventional native timbers. It won't be the first or last time.

If it were just the regular natives, I have those kicking about here, but I'm after a few lesser-knowns, so they may take a little while longer to round up and season.

Will post pics, even if a train wreck.
Last edited by kingiFiddler on Thu Apr 06, 2017 8:29 am, edited 1 time in total.


kingiFiddler
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Thu Apr 06, 2017 8:20 am

bas wrote:Wouldn't paulownia be too soft for a paddle? I used it to make a strip plank canoe but I covered both sides in fibre glass for a hard shell. I'm not sure that bare paulownia would handle any knocks too well.
Perhaps useful as a core material if balsa is unavailable? It's hard to find NZ grown Paulownia that hasn't grown too fast. Maybe in the South Island somewhere?

kingiFiddler
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Thu Apr 06, 2017 8:28 am

Mac50L wrote:
Mac50L wrote: Yes there are native timbers that would work. But do you know what they are and how to make them work?
kingiFiddler wrote:Nope and nope.
Paulownia grows in New Zealand but isn't a native. Kahikatea might be the lightest there is.
https://www.halswelltimber.co.nz/kahikatea.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dacrycarpus_dacrydioides" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

One paddle I made has a thin strip of kwila down the middle of it, 3 mm max, possible go down to 2 mm. Definitely fit tips, again I used kwila so you need to find an NZ timber, (black beech?) with similar strength/impact density.

This site has some information -

http://www.nzwood.co.nz/forestry-2/lc-t ... s-species/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Some density comparisons -

http://www.nzwood.co.nz/wp-content/uplo ... ative1.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thank you Mac50L.
Will be laminating. I figure if it paddles like a dog and weighs more than the yak, the only thing that saves it from the firewood pile will be it looks kinda interesting.

kingiFiddler
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Thu Apr 06, 2017 8:29 pm

Went looking for something special for the tips. Found some Puriri and Pohutukawa, both dense enough, but by golly I want to use this stuff, even if much less dense, simply because it's so pretty. Who can guess what species this is?
RimuFigure.jpg

Mac50L
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Thu Apr 06, 2017 10:35 pm

Using a really soft week wood you need that reinforcing down the middle and also on the edges and tip. Inuits would use bone tips and possible bone edges but a really hard wood, just enough to do the job would work OK. Those edges need to be relatively sharp, not shaving sharp but not blunt or just rounded.
I've made several blades, and have only ever used Sandy's recipe from the KASK site.
Thanks for that, at least someone reads what I write.

Hand tools will do the job but I'll admit to using an angle-grinder with sanding disks most times as well. I had an American stay for a couple of weeks after spending a winter at the South Pole supervising their new building construction. He had done some hobby crafted woodwork while there. When I mentioned angle-grinder he nearly had a heart attack. We went up to Nelson and I introduced him to someone who had built 3 strip kayaks, looked like they should be hung above the mantelpiece type quality. "I use an angle-grinder." he said. Another "heart attack" moment.

Actually you just switch the angle-grinder on, point to the wood and just scare it into submission, just the sound will do....... :)

Dreadfish
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Fri Apr 07, 2017 8:29 am

came across this in my travels along the interweb.

https://vimeo.com/207763253" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

talk about skills
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dedant
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Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:42 am

Wow! If I tried that...I would bleed! :$
I think there was a chainsaw involved too, :)
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Glass is Class.. dedant

Dreadfish
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Fri Apr 07, 2017 10:41 am

lol yeah i saw the cuts as well. the paddle was a thing of beauty
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Blazer60
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Sun Apr 09, 2017 12:10 pm

I'm new to the Greenland Paddle club and I have to say, the more I use it, the more I unlock its secrets. Magic. Never paddled so far with so much ease before - something my senior citizen bones appreciate. You are right HLD, there is no going back. :y:
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kingiFiddler
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Thu May 11, 2017 7:10 pm

If anyone has tried Kauri, how'd it work out? If anyone wants to try Kauri, I demo'd a house a few weeks ago and have a nice stack of dry 4x2's and 8x1's if anyone wants to make a GP from it. Pick up would be Mangawhai, or I could drop off between Auckland and the Far North when next up that way.

Have a few blocks of Puriri and Pohutukawa that I am thinking might make interesting paddle tips.

Does anyone have any leads on Tanekaha lumber please or know who I might try to chase that up?

Cheers,
Tony

Rastayaka
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Thu May 11, 2017 8:32 pm

Having used mine for a few months now almost every weekend thats had weather permissible to fish I tried a standard viking paddle for a bout five minutes last weekend. I read someone before said once they had gone to greenland they never went back. I second that. Can't imagine paddling anything else now.

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