Yak hard-body lure starter pack recommendations please.

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kingiFiddler
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Mon Jan 29, 2018 9:14 pm

With the astounding array of options out there for a newbie to trolling diving hard-body lures, what two or three lures would those experienced in such matters suggest please?

I'm thinking, but very happy to be corrected, I'd very much like something to prospect for snapper in the shallow but foul grounds, so a floater that'll dive around 2m at a sustainable yak speed. Then there are bait columns that I doubt form that way without assistance and it'd be great to hit around the 15-20m mark without my arms turning to wet noodles after an hour of hard paddling trying to keep a good action at those depths. Then perhaps a near-surface option for when the action is top-water? In those situations I quite like casting rather than paddling around the edges.

But that's just to outline my thinking in the rather desperate hope it might be somewhere close to a good idea and perhaps even somewhere along the lines of what others who are trying to get a handle on hard-body divers are thinking also. Maybe, if not most probably, my thinking is wrong because, if for no other of most likely many reasons, I'm coming from a position of absolutely zero experience with such lures. I mean, maybe the best 3-lure plan would be two of the same shape and size but different colours, or forgetting about trying to get three lures to cover all three different aforementioned scenarios, and focus on, say, three lures for one of the scenarios, or two for one and one for another?

I see Dr Evil and Strike Pro mentioned but there seems to be tens if not more different styles of such brands. It appears to me a rabbit hole I can't afford to jump down.

There is already a few hundred dollars worth of such lures in shopping carts on various websites I frequent while I try to make up my mind what to try and fail miserably to do so. There is no way I can afford to drop that sort of $ on such frivolous pursuits. I've already provided the prosecution with ample evidence of budgetary ill-discipline and if judge/jury/executioner rule against me, it'll be curtains for yak fishing.

Any help much appreciated. I feel like I'm swimming in quicksand with this stuff.

Cheers,
Tony

dedant
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Tue Jan 30, 2018 8:06 am

I think if you asked ten people to pick their favourite lures you will get twelve different answers! :D
However , the ones I use are the Classic Dr Evil (5m and deeper), Strike Pro Sonic is aother, there is a "new" StrikePro Archback Deep Diver model 12cm , I am thinking of ordering, ( H&F will get them in from Kilwell)
Shallow water and for subsurface I use the West Shell 8631-110 slow sinking in Green, also have a purple/brown one too. West Shell Tackle are online or the showroom / store is in Albany.
Dr Evil is through Aussie online tackle shops, (MoTackle etc )
Smaller floating stickbaits or popper style flies could be used as topwater for kahawai, skippy etc.
Savage Gear and Halco have a couple of lures that will run well too. ( more than a couple in my collection have come from the clearance/bargin bins of tackle stores! )
I haven't had experience with Rapala lures behind the kayak
Steve Tapp wrote a good article on this very subject a while ago, it may be on the Viking Website or archived somewhere, Hope this helps.. :)
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Glass is Class.. dedant

kingiFiddler
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Tue Jan 30, 2018 2:06 pm

Thanks Ant. Have read a few articles and posts from Stephen and they are very helpful. He mentions strike pro 28grm lures. I downloaded the latest strike pro catalogue from the Oz distributors website and got in way over my head trying to find the shape and weight of lure Stephen posted a photo of.

Also developed an unhealthy lust for the DUO lures. Especially the DUO Realis crankbait deep divers that are said to get to about 10m but without the 'usual' effort. As much as they look beautiful, and noting the claims of them being superior in every way, I'm reminded of the fact a 20 cent 1 oz sinker can hit the same depths with zero effort. Even deeper if the current isn't much :-)
For all the ease of getting and staying down there, if they can't 'lure' fish I can see a tackle box stuffed with expensive paper weights if not careful.

And, c'mon, how's a noob to these things supposed to think about this type :
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Last edited by kingiFiddler on Tue Jan 30, 2018 2:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

kingiFiddler
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Tue Jan 30, 2018 2:15 pm

In the best tradition of dysfunctional school committees across the country, how about we form a diving hard-body committee of those ten anglers you mentioned, each one of us buying or donating a single lure and colour thereof to the greater good knowledge base and we each use and write a review and then share the lures and see how they go in other areas - lord knows what works one place might suck in another locale. Then we have a fighting chance, or was that a chance of fighting, to disseminate to others what works and where, hopefully saving everyone from the time-honoured curse of many a fisho with hundreds of dollars wasted on bright shiny things.

*editing to add an idea*

A while back I organised a PLB group buy. It worked and wasn't anywhere near as much of a hassle as I thought it would be.
I'm wondering if someone of far more (well, at least of the better variety) repute than myself could approach a tackle supplier for a collection of 'sample lures' that can be passed around forum members keen to try 'em, with the understanding the lures remain circulating in perpetuity or until lost to the sea, and anglers writing their reviews on here and readers are encouraged to purchase their favourite lures from said supplier? Kind of like a travelling roadshow amongst KFNZ members.

Any particular lure can stay in the possession of a member for two weeks minimum thereafter it goes to whoever is next on the list.

This all of course assuming Jason and Co are OK with us name dropping the forum to snaffle some samples for free or a hopefully heavily discounted cost?
Last edited by kingiFiddler on Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.

dedant
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Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:24 pm

I coudn't find the old larger Sonic ( I have two ) on the Strike pro website either, the newer Archback one looks about right though.
I have a completely unscientific and no doubt technicaly flawed anacdotal ( my English spelling is awful, I know) "test" , one time out off Sullivans Bay I trolled my Dr Evil along side another Club member using the StrikePro , he caught one to my three. Maybe it was colour, slight depth, trolling speed , leader material, hook size or the colour underwear we were wearing that made a difference, who knows? :D
I might go up there on a "day off" and only take two rods for trolling and nothing but bibbed lures...if I'm brave enough. :?:
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Glass is Class.. dedant

kingiFiddler
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Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:02 am

Thanks for that. Can I ask what were the colours of the lures you had success with please?
I see Motackle are out of Dr Evils.

dedant
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Wed Jan 31, 2018 10:39 am

Here you go. :)
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AndrewRawlingson
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Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:20 am

Dr Evil all the way (based on one trip!), better get to the gym and start working those muscles, or buy a motor :rofl:

Seriously though, if you're after snapper, it's going to have to be a deep diver. I know that snapper can be caught all the way up to the surface, but in general, they are in the bottom third of the water column. A deep diver is always going to create a lot of drag, I can't see any way around this without getting overly complicated.
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kingiFiddler
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Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:59 pm

AndrewRawlingson wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:20 am
getting overly complicated.
Yeah. If you get a chance, read the blurb on the DUO Realis G87 Crankbait 20A. Sounds like brain surgery would be easier to achieve successfully than what they have come up with. Here's the opening claim:
The DUO Marketeers wrote: Crankbait engineering beyond barriers, beyond frontiers, beyond belief

kingiFiddler
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Wed Jan 31, 2018 1:08 pm

AndrewRawlingson wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:20 am
Dr Evil all the way
I'm beginning to suspect JM Gillies in Oz are no longer making the Dr Evil lure. I bet there are a few people that frequent these boards who are about 4 years ahead of at least me, who have hoovered up every one of those golden tickets they could find the moment they twigged to the pending shortage.
Last edited by kingiFiddler on Wed Jan 31, 2018 1:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.


kingiFiddler
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Wed Jan 31, 2018 1:09 pm

dedant wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 10:39 am
Here you go. :)
Thanks Ant. That's quite a variety.

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Marc N
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Wed Jan 31, 2018 3:35 pm

As one who spends more time getting caught by lures, than actually fishing with them, I came across this one, looks like a bit of a deep diver.


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VALKOHAI

Fishmaster Elite4 'yak
Fishing for every thing from Trout to Kingfish

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Marc N
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Wed Jan 31, 2018 3:52 pm

And I've ordered a couple of these...

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VALKOHAI

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kingiFiddler
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Wed Jan 31, 2018 4:42 pm

Are those bigger ones the Proberos lures? I have towed one around briefly. The whole yak shakes like it's towing an epileptic garbage can. :)

dedant
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Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:24 pm

Comparison time :) The smaller one is a Halco Crazy Diver , comes with two interchangable bibs ( yes , I lost the other one :( ) Two middle ones are Dr Evil , two larger ones are boatshow specials from a couple of years ago , I don't remember the brand. Towing one is like driving a car with square wheels :D
If I try to pull both upcurrent at the same time I think I'd get dragged backwards!
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Casualtyward
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Wed Jan 31, 2018 10:14 pm

Vibration is a good thing, it means the lure is working hard.

I’ll just throw this out there for starters http://www.vikingkayaks.co.nz/kayaking+ ... ephen+tapp

I have a few lures that I troll on occasion. I bought some Dr Evils a couple of years ago from Mo Tackle. They dive deep - I try to have at least 9-10m depth to run it. I’ve hit the bottom in 7.5m with one. I’ve had my best luck with the purple/silver model and the gold model. They are like towing a sea plow though so I save them for days when conditions are good and I’m feeling energetic. Towing them into the breeze wears me out pretty quickly.

http://www.kayakfishingnz.com/forum/vie ... il#p190019

I also have a few Strike Pro Supersonics (28g). I really like the look of the silver/yellow colour. It looks like a little jack mack. I haven’t had as much success with them, but then I don’t tow them very often. I also have some in green/yellow and a silvery pearl colour with orange stripes (haven’t tried this one yet). I bought mine direct from the States because Kilwell were all out. They’re a bit easier to tow because they have a smaller bib.

I have also had success using bibless blade lures for kahawai. They tow nicely and only have a little resistance. I use a 28g red/silver Halco (I think).

I need to get out more so I can keep testing.


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kingiFiddler
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Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:05 pm

Thanks for that info.
I have found a few of the supersonic lures still available on Ebay. The 27.5gm is the 80mm model from what I can gather.

I still think having a sample selection (of in-production models) and passing these amongst as many KFNZ members as possible would be the best way to sort the wheat from the chaff. Simply leveraging the internet and site membership for nation-wide trials. But none of the lure distributors I have emailed with this idea have returned my contact except for one in Oz who gave me the NZ agent details. So I guess that idea is dead in the water. ;(

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Hairy Little Dwarf
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Fri Feb 02, 2018 3:18 pm

FiddlerofKingies wrote: But none of the lure distributors I have emailed with this idea have returned my contact except for one in Oz who gave me the NZ agent details. So I guess that idea is dead in the water.
Try changing the lure if they aren't biting :lol:

[Waits for laughs....not a sausage, exits stage left]
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dedant
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Fri Feb 02, 2018 4:38 pm

Hairy Little Dwarf wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 3:18 pm
FiddlerofKingies wrote: But none of the lure distributors I have emailed with this idea have returned my contact except for one in Oz who gave me the NZ agent details. So I guess that idea is dead in the water.
Try changing the lure if they aren't biting :lol:

[Waits for laughs....not a sausage, exits stage left]
My ADHD is awesome to have for lure fishing! :lol: Although I would paddle a lot further if I didn't have to stop to change lures so often :$
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Glass is Class.. dedant

kingiFiddler
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Fri Feb 02, 2018 5:31 pm

Hairy Little Dwarf wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 3:18 pm
FiddlerofKingies wrote: But none of the lure distributors I have emailed with this idea have returned my contact except for one in Oz who gave me the NZ agent details. So I guess that idea is dead in the water.
Try changing the lure if they aren't biting :lol:

[Waits for laughs....not a sausage, exits stage left]
Frankly, I think they are just too scared of being exposed as snake oil sellers, flogging useless trinkets to any fisho that has the cash. Maybe I should start naming and shaming the distributors and lure brands who never got back to me. The ones who are happy to take our money but are too stingy and/or illegitimate to give anything back to the speed bump community.
:lol:

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